Tacos, Tarantino and Tequila - Raphael de Anda, Taqueria Hoy and 4 Copas

SPEAKER_00 0:55

Welcome back to the United States of Dramerica. And we will be talking about whiskey, but we'll also be talking about another drink as part of this. So I'm very pleased to have on a man who came uh who I first met in a taco and quesadilla capacity. But we bonded over whiskey and uh we will now we are now bonding over tequila as well. Welcome to the show. Rafael Deander, who is uh the vice president of Tacaria Oi, which is we'll talk about in a minute, is a number of uh Mexican restaurants across Orange County. He's also um the founder of one tequila brand, uh Diva Tillo, sounds fun. Um, and then uh he is uh the global brand ambassador for Full Copels, which is another tequila which is uh going crazy at the moment. Welcome, a man who wears many hats. Uh Raphael.

SPEAKER_03 1:51

Yes, both literally and figuratively, uh we wear many hats on this side. But uh I'm honored to be on uh with us, such an esteemed friend. So thank you, thank you, David, for having me on.

SPEAKER_00 2:00

So as we always do, we start with whiskey and what we're drinking. So um what I like here is um I am a big fan of Alexander Murray, obviously. Um and Chris Custer, the founder, uh sorry, the CEO of Alexander Murray, was uh guest number one and co-host at the beginning of this 104 episodes ago. Um but um not a lot of people know Alexander Murray. They drink a lot of Alexander Murray because of the things they do at Costco and Trader Joe's and other places, but not necessarily is it a brand that's particularly well known. And yet, Raphael, um, when you first discovered that you know they were the official whiskey of Orange County Soccer Club and I was friends with the owner, you got very excited. So tell me what you're what you're drinking tonight and also your sort of history with the brand.

SPEAKER_03 2:48

Absolutely. Well, I'm honored to say I'm drinking the Orange County Soccer Club edition of Alexander Murray. It is uh one of my most dear bottles that are in my uh esteemed collection. Um, but I actually have a personal connection to the brand as well. Um for my bachelor party, my brother came very excitedly. Um we celebrated it in Tulum. It was my brother, me, and uh two of my closest cousins. And we wanted to keep it small for our uh sort of stage our destination, uh bachelor party. And he brought me a bottle of Alexander Murray to celebrate uh my going away to the world of marriage. So it will forever be connected to me in a very sentimental way. And now with the connection uh with the soccer team and with yourself, um, and just the brand in general has always been very near and dear to my heart. That's great.

SPEAKER_00 3:41

So, how did he find it, or why did he pick that one for you?

SPEAKER_03 3:44

He went on a shopping spree, uh, I believe it was uh high times here in Costa Mesa, uh California, and it's one of our uh dear stores as well. So they came off a recommendation there.

SPEAKER_00 3:56

Love it. That's great. Well, I mean it is great. So obviously we met because actually, sorry, let's let's let's do some more, let's do some whiskey thing. So you pour yourself a glass. So I've got one. You might not have this. Yeah, what are you drinking? This is another Alexander Murray one, but this is one of the so the inspiration to do the Orange County Soccer Club single mall, first sports team in America to have one. Um, was they did a special edition with Arnold Schwarzenegger's charity. Um I've got a bottle of you can go this one. This is the Muck Schwarzenegger. Uh they did it, they did a special edition, it's finished in Austrian oak, um which I think was his nickname. Um it's great. So it's uh these sort of special editions are uh the theme for this evening. So uh let me just pour mine out. Okay, so that's that. So uh cheers. Um yeah, so we we uh you are uh obviously uh we met because of Tacary always. So three restaurants in Orange County um and food trucks which appear at all of our games. You signed, I think it was a six-year partnership deal. Um it was gonna be four, but you said if I took you to the Magic Castle, you do another couple of years work well for everyone. Um and so you're the you signed the longest deal in club history, and obviously our fans therefore enjoy your food at every game. And I and actually now my kids as well, I'm a creature of habit. I only really eat the same thing. So I have a chicken quesadilla every time I'm in your restaurant, and every time uh I'm uh at the game. So I think I've had nearly a hundred chicken quesadillas served by you and your team. Um I'm a big fan of that. Um so thank you, thank you.

SPEAKER_03 5:47

I'm honored uh to to form a significant part of your diet by this point in the season.

SPEAKER_00 5:51

Yeah, absolutely. So we're definitely look, we're gonna talk about the um the tequila. I want to start talking about the restaurants because I I think I've I've I remember talking to your brother about it. I'm absolutely fascinated by how all this works because particularly I think two of your restaurants are 24 hours. Um how does one end up running three uh popular uh Mexican restaurants in Orange County, which obviously has a high percentage Hispanic restaurant, and there are a lot of there are a lot of uh Mexican restaurants as you'd expect. Um and talk me through the whole 24-hour thing, which is I guess sort of brave and clever. I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 6:33

The whole story of how Takuri Oe came to be is one that started back in 1980. My father was an immigrant to this amazing, beautiful country, um, not speaking uh uh one word of English, and he had a big dream, you know, try to succeed in the the land uh where the American dream is possible. So he he got to the US and said, Hey, uh I want to bring the food from our small little town. We're from a town called Arandas Jalisco, uh, about an hour and a half from Guadalajara. And this will tie into our conversation, but it is known famously for tacos and tequila. That's our two big exports to the world. And so when he got here, Orange County did not have a family-friendly place for um, especially the Mexican community, to go and eat their own food. Um, the the famous soft taco here was not well established uh in the early 80s. So he uh, along with a few other members of his family, um, started the business. He was president from day one, and they opened up a little taco cart in Fullerton, California, and uh slowly started working, working. And at that time, Fullerton wasn't known as the best area in the world. Um it was uh uh a rough and tumble neighborhood, to say the least. And they saved up some money, was able to buy a food truck, and they would park it in our 4th street location that it is today. That used to be an old billiard hall. And the owners of the billiard hall ended up taking uh so much love for my father and his mission that instead of selling it to the general public, they offered it to you know a couple of young kids from Mexico who spoke broken English and said, Hey boys, you know, I see you guys working your butts off. How about uh would you guys be interested in buying our building? And the rest is history from there. Um at one point my father was managing 13 different locations. Um and the nature of the business took many turns, uh, a lot of ups and downs over the years since that founding in 1980. But uh we're happy to say, you know, we're very uh uh content, very uh blessed with Takareo Oi with all the developments we've had, especially since our founding, um, to our modern name. And we're in the process of building our fourth location right there in Tussin. Uh famously, uh it was used for a movie Once Upon a Time in Hollywood by Quentin Tarantino. Oh, interesting. Um yeah, the outside of that building. Um it's still currently up, and we will re redevelop it into a Takery Oi. But it will be it was used uh during a very quick clip. There's about five seconds of fame where they turn on the lights on an old Taco Bell towards the later half of the film. But that's our claim to fame. He he came to Tustin and filmed in our building. So that was really cool. I got to show him around. My mother didn't even know who this director was and we're going to dinner. And he they made us wait two hours. And so he got off his big bus with all of his film crew. And I said, Well, Mr. Tarantino, uh, Modi Mike, can I can we take a photograph? He goes, No, the movie title hasn't even been announced yet. Well, we we we can't say, Okay, well, my mother and I were waiting to go to dinner, and he goes, Where's your mother? So he gets off of the bus and gives her a big hug and says, apologized, and what he's so he was very sweet and gracious um for our five minutes that we had with him, but it was a cool experience nonetheless.

SPEAKER_00 9:57

Did you cater the set or did they already do something?

SPEAKER_03 10:01

No, unfortunately, we did not, but he did uh come and film, and I wasn't able to be present during the filming, even though I was invited. I had a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to go to Russia to see Mexico playing the World Cup. So that was uh Yeah, that and and on top of that, the miracle happened where we beat Germany 1-0. So um, that was an opportunity. I I still don't uh you know regret not going to the filming, but it was you know, uh it was a very cool uh to say that Quentin Sarantino was part of our uh our story.

SPEAKER_00 10:31

So so so you're obviously I've been to you. So you've got one in Santa Ana, one in Orange, uh one in Anaheim. I've obviously I've been to all of them, all times of day or night. So um my one dish I always eat. You can have a chicken case to do at any time of day, I've discovered. So there've been occasions where I've woken up slightly hung over in Orange County and just gone there for breakfast. Um, I think there's times I came off a transatlantic flight and had come straight to work and I stopped for break for food then. I've lunched there regularly. I think the latest I've been, I've been for a dinner at sort of seven or eight o'clock. I haven't experienced the full value of, you know, I haven't been at three o'clock in the morning, but talk me through the decision because obviously, you know, in Vegas, lots of places are open 24 hours, and there's some McDonald's and and taco bells, I guess. But you don't see normal restaurants open for 24 hours all that often. So talk me through sort of why you did it and and what it's like in there in the middle of the night.

SPEAKER_03 11:33

We definitely get some characters late at night. Um, but more than anything, it's we opened late for two main reasons. One was the security aspect. Back in the day, if you close, it lent itself to have interesting personalities come and do some rough housing for uh around the building. So what my father decided to do was why don't we just stay open and use that to clean and to prep for the following day? And we would just remain open for whoever comes to the restaurant. We'd be happy to feed them, but it wasn't a point of uh emphasis to essentially serve the customers. It was the time that we used to check on the hoods, to do our own cleaning, to uh make sure everything was to the standard that we expect. And over time, people started putting one and two together and they said, hey, tacare oi, it was open at any moment of the day. And it ended up uh being caught our our hallmark, our calling card, uh, we're your home away from home, no matter what time of day it is. And um the second part is a lot of factory workers uh that are important to our community as Mexicans Americans, um, will get out late or will start very early. And so we will be open and we it's not uncommon to have uh the laborer come by and say, hey, give me three burritos, my shift's gonna start. This is where I'm gonna go to pick up my meal for the day. Um, and then we end up knowing who they are, and we'll have a really nice relationship with them. And that that night shift crowd is has become uh almost like a part of our family where there are uh some during the week there there are less individuals, but you know them better. And during the weekend, it's all the clubs getting out usually at 2 a.m. and coming. And we've had people bring boom boxes and have their own parties in our dining room, and um, it's it's been a different kind of cast of characters. Um sometimes the celebrities from the Honda Center will come by, and I've had a lot of different Mexican performers uh come and say, Hey, I'll rent out your dining room. Um, just don't let any customers in. I said, Well, we can't quite do that, but if you'd like, you can fill it up and customers can just still come in order and then take their order to go. And so we've had uh you know, some Mexican celebrities such as Joan Sebastian, Jenny Rivera, uh other uh theaters of the norte that have come. So different the Mexican celebrities especially have come by um and enjoyed our tacos late at night. So 24-hour crowd, it's a it's a unique one. You're missing out on the opportunity to come and see all the cast of characters that come around two to three in the morning, especially at the five in the morning. Ooh, that's the key one, Dan.

SPEAKER_00 14:01

I see this as a challenge. Uh and also I'm gonna mention this because just by saying, and I we talked about this when I saw you the other day, just by saying the words out loud is gonna make this thing happen, which is in this country, and I'm I'm sort of new to this world, but in this country, fantasy football leagues are a big deal, and we ran one at the club, and the forfeit, which is obviously in no way meant to disparage the restaurant, it's just we thought it would be very fun. The forfeit is somebody has to come to your restaurant. Um, and there's this girl Heaven who works in my team, uh, who came last. I I didn't enter, uh I would have come last probably, but yeah. Um, and so she's got to stay for 24 hours in the restaurant, but for every taco she eats, she'll get out an hour off. Oh man. Um, so we're excited to to see what that looks like, and maybe she'll get to see it at four o'clock in the morning, or not, depending on how many tacos she has.

SPEAKER_03 14:54

So absolutely. No, she can see firsthand uh all the adventures that we have.

SPEAKER_00 15:00

What I quite like is I was trying to explain it to my my 11-year-old daughter and my 14-year-old son. They copy me and they love your food, and they always eat the same thing now. And we were there a couple of weekends ago. My daughter was at the Olivia Rodrigo concert, and my son and I had to kill some time before we went to pick them up. So we went to one of our locations and we went in there, and uh, he was asking me why it's so popular. I was trying to explain. I don't I'm not sure if it's quite the right way to explain it, but they've got food for people like me, as in it's very very good food. It's always very good Mexican food, but like there's things I can order that I understand, you know, chicken for example, beef. But you also have I don't know if they're more exotic, but you have the meats that are found uh traditions from from Mexico. Um, and so I've never tried any of these, and maybe I need to praise them. But but tell tell me about the things that I haven't ordered from your menu.

SPEAKER_03 15:58

Absolutely. So uh I'm sure the I'm not have you ever tried the our Al Pastor? Yes. Okay, so our our four most popular meats uh which are the uh are carnitas and al pastor, which are two pork dishes, um, and then we have chicken and beef. Those are the the standard Hallmark ones that we especially we bring to every match. Now the exotic, I call them authentic meats, are the buce, which is pork belly. Uh we also have uh the cow cheek, we call it cabesa, and my favorite is the lingua, uh beef tongue. And the especially the the cheek and the tongue are steamed, they're very tender. Believe it or not, the tongue is actually our most expensive protein that we sell because a cow only has one tongue. It may have three stomachs, but only has one tongue. And it's a delicious meat, especially if you have it with some salsa verde, uh, some green salsa, uh, and you you get it in a corn tortilla. It's very few delicacies in this world, Dan. And one day I hope to enjoy one of these uh beautiful tacos with you.

SPEAKER_00 17:08

We are having lunch together in the coming week, so maybe there's hope. I'll try it. I've got to try, I've got I've got to experience more things. Okay. Um, so just last couple of questions about about this before we move on to the alcohol stuff. So um how many apologies, I should have asked you to practice question. How many uh how many tacos would you sell you know in a normal week? Oh man, we're gonna thousands.

SPEAKER_03 17:40

Um that's a tough question. Are we having an Orange County Cypher Club Beer Fest games? Is that included?

SPEAKER_00 17:54

Um Yeah, I I'll be I'm gonna I'm gonna ask you, I'll give you a chance to to prepare this answer. I might put it in the uh in the comments after you know what I mean. I'm just interested in like how many a restaurant that's 24 hours would sell in a week.

SPEAKER_03 18:08

It just varies. For example, there would be weeks where we'll have the we have a banquet hall in San Ana that we rent out for Quintanera's birthday parties and what have you, right there in downtown San Ana. And it fits up to 250 people. So typically we'll feed the those guests, and sometimes once, especially once it closes around midnight, they'll come to the restaurant and eat as well. Um, so that we'll have that crowd on top of that. For example, this week was a really busy week where we had uh a football match, uh American football, to be clear, uh, right there in downtown Santa Ana. Plus, we had the amazing uh beer fest uh with with you guys at Orange County Soccer Club. And it's it's a big volume. I mean, we're looking, I had to put a uh this is a very sporadic number, but uh uh close to 50,000 tacos, um I'd say. Um so it's a it's a large amount of food. We get our meats delivered by the palate, um, our onions, our tomatillo for salsa twice a week at minimum, and those are a palate each. Um so we'll we go through some decent volume, I'd like to say.

SPEAKER_00 19:12

Okay, amazing. 50,000 tacos. That's a serious number of tacos. Um I don't want to be obsessed with celebrity, but you started it with Quentin Tarantina, and obviously you mentioned tomatists from the Honda Center. Who's the most famous customer you've had across your stores, would you say? Apart from Mexico.

SPEAKER_03 19:29

Oh well, uh that's a tough question. You know, we've we've hosted a few of Mexico's head coaches, which are uh very cool. We've had signings uh at the restaurant. Um in our early days, uh pretty much any famous Mexican celebrity that would uh be in town would stop by at our restaurant. Um now I'm saying if we're talking about general public, I know that Kobe Bryant and his wife were big fans of our tacos. Um unfortunately before his passing, but yes, they they're familiar with uh taco and what have you. So um that that was that's probably I'd say uh our most uh famous guest. But Freddie Freeman has been rumored to be stopping by at our orange location. He is uh El Medina high school alum, and that is right around the corner from Orange High School. Uh my manager swears it's uh him and his family uh are very good friends of his. So I'll take his word. I love that. That's great.

SPEAKER_00 20:20

Um all right, so let's um we're gonna have to pour another drink actually for the second part. So obviously, this is a whiskey podcast, although, as I often say, it's it's the whiskey podcast that's not about whiskey because it's about the people we interview who are interesting people, and the whiskey is just what brings us together. And obviously, you know, you and I obviously we bonded over football and tacos and quesadilla, um, but we also bonded over over whiskey uh and a bit of golf. But you know, you've you've uh I'm aware of your tequila brands, um, and uh I'm gonna pour myself a tequila. So we don't normally drink the tequila, but I'm going to because you gave me an extraordinary, extraordinary bottle. Um, so I'm gonna try it. So and then we'll join you. Let's talk about four copers. So um it is the world's first organic and kosher tequila, I believe.

SPEAKER_03 21:13

Yes, yes. So what you have in your hand is a little piece of history right there. So make sure you enjoy it.

SPEAKER_00 21:19

Right. So tell me tell me the story, because this brand is 29 years old, is that right? Correct.

SPEAKER_03 21:25

We were found in 1997, and I'm actually drinking it out of one of the our original hand-blown glass bottles from the late 90s as well.

SPEAKER_00 21:33

I'll pick one of those, just so you know. I'm actually my my glass, if you look at this. So this is the first so it's a so my relationship with tequila, uh it's actually a bit like my relationship with whiskey. So I was a terrible you know, when I was a kid, I didn't know what I was doing. And in England particularly, tequila you just do the sort of slammer thing with you know, the sort and the Uh and the lime. And I never really drunk real tequila. And interestingly, actually, Chris from Alexander Murray first got me into grown-up tequila. Okay. I was in his store one day, and I think somebody a rep from somebody was doing a whole thing. So we tasted like grown-up real tequila. And I realized that tequila isn't just a silly drink you slam. Like good tequila is a real drink. Um but I got these glasses. We were down in the old town in um San Diego, and I was trying out some tequila with a marriage band. And uh they sold me some glasses, and I that that's my main tequila drink until you give me your tequila glasses. All right, I'm gonna pour myself some of this extraordinary drink. So go on, sorry, tell me the story of sure.

SPEAKER_03 22:44

I'll tell you the great story of Cuatro Copas with Cuatro Copas in hand.

SPEAKER_00 22:50

Oh love it.

SPEAKER_03 22:53

So what you're drinking right there is our añejo. That one is a 18 month in single-use uh whiskey barrels. And it's sorry, let me I think there's some activity in the back, so let me mute it real quick. Are you does the double come through or no? Uh okay, great. I was I was a little concerned, I heard some voices. Um I'll start. Cuatro copas has an amazing history, it being the the world's first organic and kosher tequila.

SPEAKER_00 23:22

Sorry, it's so good. I've just this is the thing of being for people who don't drink tequila, is good tequila is like like good whiskey. It's so smooth compared to the the horrible cheap stuff that you down in bars. This is unbelievable. It's so smooth. Thank you, thank you. It's so smooth. Sorry.

SPEAKER_03 23:40

Well, it's been a labor of love. Uh my family's from a tequila personal town called Aranda Felisco, and there's very famous brands in the area: Don Julio, Patron, Casadores, uh Tapatillo is one that's very common over there in that area, tequila ocho these days. Um, so there's many distilleries and many historic families that are from that region. My grandfather on my mother's side was a very well-known merchant and agava grower. Um so he owns swaths of, I guess the equivalent in America would be of Napa Valley, just for tequila. Um, he at one point was vice president of the town and very instrumental in building out what modern-day Arab investes. Um he unfortunately passed before I was born. So my mother was able to inherit some of those lands, and that started kind of our fascination um in our generation with uh tequila. So my I say, I always say my family was born among the agavas. And the brand uh was founded in 1997, and it has an amazing story being that we do not come from a very established tequila pedigree for our producing family. Many big brands are very tied to the Tamarena family name or a Castelline producer near the tequila volcano. Um, these are historic legacy brands. Arep is another one. We do not come from a legacy like that. We come from a legacy of agave growing. We are farmers. So we thought, how are we going to distinguish ourselves in the saturated market? And Cuatro Copas became world famous for being the first certified organic tequila. We were the first ones that said, okay, come and look at our agave. American and European third parties come and verify that we do not put any additives or pesticides in our agave growing process or production. So we were granted the official approval and became the first tequila ever. And along the way, we invited our good friends, the rabbis, to come and uh certify us to uh it added an extra level of differentiation. Um the the certificate the certification came in about 2006, and by then we had already been uh very established uh with 11 years of producing tequila. And my family became involved in the four copas story, being that the there were four original founders in Cuatro Copas, and it's also named after a very famous mariachi song uh by a gentleman called Joseph Fredo Jimenez, who is a world-famous uh mariachi singer, and he also sings a song called Quatro Copas. So it all types. What does four copas mean? Four copas means four glasses or four cups.

SPEAKER_04 26:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 26:26

And is the the story goes that there was a mariachi that saw a former flame, and with four glasses, they reminisced over the good old days. Lovely. And my my father became involved in the project uh a few years after its founding. And about a year or two after it became certified organic, uh, we became more and more involved, especially in the American production side. They wanted to bring in a family that was from the Agava growing region and wanted to see how they can incorporate in the growth. A few years after that, we became the majority owners. And we have so my family has been producing quatre cocas for over 20 years.

SPEAKER_00 27:06

Amazing. It's amazing. So I keep seeing, I mean, obviously I know the way social media works, it's designed to sort of tell you things you already know. But I keep seeing stuff everywhere. You keep winning awards and yeah, I know you and your brother are traveling all over the country talking about like what what's happening that's making it so interesting at the moment?

SPEAKER_03 27:30

The brand had a boom when it first started. We were known among many distributors, especially early big distributors, as the Patron Before Patron. It was growing at a rapid pace, and the original ownership group, while being the world-class producers that they were, were not great businessmen. And the brand, unfortunately, had a dark period. It went and disappeared for some time, and that's where my family became instrumental in reviving this historic brand. So we brought it back with some gusto. And once uh, especially lately, more and more people over time started figuring out hey, this is the four copas that we grew to love. Uh where had it been? We're, you know, I've I've heard stories from my father telling me how he drank four copas. I've heard stories of my grandfather saying that he knew four copas. And as time goes on, the word starts spreading little by little. Today we are distributed in about 30 states, Italy and soon to be Argentina. And as the word comes out as well of my family, we were actually used to be quite behind the scenes. We never used to say uh that we were the owners of quatro copas just because we didn't want the hoopla, we didn't want people to essentially say, hey, the the Deanda family also owned four copas. Um and the time came for us to come out publicly and say, hey, you know, I Rafael Deanda am a global brand ambassador. And so that came out about a year and a half ago. And once there was a face to the brand, uh I think that's where the this the next round of interest came in. And we've been very blessed to have uh very great awards. Um originally we were named uh best spirit in the San Francisco Spirits Festival. Um Food and Wine named us uh Best Spirit of the Year in 2006. And lately we we got the Best Año Tequila. So what you're drinking now, uh it was labeled Best Año Tequila of 2026. Um and we've been published in everything from Rolling Stone to uh many other big publications within the last year and a half, two years.

SPEAKER_00 29:37

Right. It's great. It's a great it it tastes magnificent. Um and uh it feels like a a a premium drink. But you've you you've got another brand as well because um you have um it's it's a newer brand with a much more lively label translates as fun, but you've got uh uh divertido as well. So how much tequila can one family make?

SPEAKER_03 30:07

Well, come to find out, you can make quite a bit. So divertido, we were approached by our importer. Uh our importer is uh a gentleman who also carries with him uh great history. His name is Henry Price. He was the first importer of Jaegermeister and Luxardo cherries. Um those are the two very famous products, among many others that he has uh imported, but he's a German descent. Um, and he's been a great mentor and friend of ours for many, many years, especially to me. Um I know his daughter's also involved in the business and is very close to my wife. So uh we we worked in in lockstep, and he said, uh, Rafael, uh, but I want you to develop a tequila that is slightly different from your four copas. You guys make a very, very good tequila, but we want this to be something that uses a little bit more modern production methods. So we just our four copas is cooked using the clay ovens, the famous ornos. Um from there, we use our grinding trains, and the quality of agave also will vary between both. The organic agave is more prone to illness, and many times you might lose a field or two due to a plague. With the non-organic agave, you're able to use uh pesticides and fertilizers, um, albeit uh it's a little bit more controlled, but the risk factor isn't quite as high. So we use what's called an autoclave or an autoclave, which is think of a giant pressure cooker. And it's much more efficient in the cooking, you don't lose nearly as as much yield. And that was uh essentially the main differentiator between quatro copas, which is made very artisanally, versus divertido, which is meant to have fun. And even though it's still a premium product, the production methods are a little bit more modern.

SPEAKER_00 31:53

So yeah, got it, got it. So, how how do you drink your four copas and how do you recommend people do? Because obviously, one thing I've learned over the years of drinking is when I was a kid, I thought sort of cheap booze goes in cocktails and good booze you drink in coils. But actually, you know, I'll put uh single morts in the right sort of whiskey cocktail. Um and you know, again, if you've got high quality mixes as well, you can do sensible things with real drinks. But how do you drink your uh your four copers and how do you recommend people shoot?

SPEAKER_03 32:27

Just well, many tequila producers, you'll come to find out, will drink uh different expressions in tequila. You start with the blanco, and then you have the reposado, which is aged between two months and one year, and then you have the añeco, which is one to three years, and then you can go even further with saying three years plus is considered an extra añeco. What you're tasting here is an añeco, which has been aged in whiskey barrels, because I know this is a whiskey podcast, so I figured this is something that helps us bridge the gap. But many tequila producers will drink blanco, the unaged expression. And uh, we like the taste of agave. We like we that if you make a good blanco, the rest of the tequila that follows, it's essentially the same liquid, just aged in barrel. So we want to see if this is a quality product, we don't want to hide behind the sweetness that the barrel will release. Um, so you'll find me drinking many times the blanco neat at room temperature. But if many times uh our friends would like to make a skinny margarita, which we made famous with Javier's back in the early 2000s, uh we that is more than welcome. We welcome any kind of experimentation. Um, four copas is meant to be had with at least three friends in yourself.

SPEAKER_00 33:44

So four cups that makes perfect sense. My um my neighbors introduced me to old-fashioned made with tequila, and now that's my absolute when I'm in a bar and I'm ordering a cocktail, um tequila old-fashioned is my is my drink at the moment. Works well with Mezcal, but I imagine this would be amazing in a tequila old-fashioned.

SPEAKER_03 34:07

Absolutely, especially with our high-proofed uh añeco, which is barrel shrinks. I think that one really comes through quite nicely. Uh, but any añejo, uh, especially I think our four copes añejo is an excellent anecho to make an old-fashioned. And I know I enjoy those quite a bit as well.

SPEAKER_00 34:22

So you're you're in 30 states.

SPEAKER_03 34:24

Is California one of them? Yes, California is our biggest state.

SPEAKER_00 34:29

So, where can where can one buy it in California, either on or off premise?

SPEAKER_03 34:35

Sure, you can find it online through our website. You can go through our amazing partners such as High Times Wine and Spirits, right there in Costa Mesa, Total Wine will carry us, San Francisco Spirit Shop. Um, we specialize in the independent model. Um, these small uh family-owned operations are something that aligns with our values as well. Um but nonetheless, we will work with uh the giants such as Total Wine and West and uh other great partners like that. And are there a few bars as well around serving you? Yes, um El Matador and Costa Mesa, I know carries us. Um and where sometimes the the names all get confused. I know we were at the montage uh uh I haven't visited recently, but we the the bar did carry us as well in Laguna Beach. Um so there's I would say we're everywhere nowhere. We're not the big players, we are still family owned and small. Um, but we we do have a little bit more of a reach these days.

SPEAKER_00 35:32

Right. I should actually recommend people go to High Times to buy it because that's also the only place you can buy the Orange County Soccer Club whiskey as well. So you can get one of each while you're there. That would be the which is an excellent product. Exactly.

SPEAKER_03 35:45

Um now uh Dan uh where did your love for whiskey first start?

SPEAKER_00 35:52

Good question. I I feel like I might have told this story once before on this podcast, but I quite like the story, I'll tell you again. So I didn't drink whiskey as a kid, and um I had one very unfortunate experience when I was at university. I was I spent a year in Canada and I had a very big night that involved some very cheap uh whiskey um and maybe some mushrooms. Um and um it was not a great experience. I was very ill for about three days actually. Um and um the smell of whiskey made me. So I basically didn't drink whiskey for probably I think it was like eight years. And included in that time when I was a journalist, I used to get invited to all sorts of great events. And I remember we were f I think the Irish Tourist Broad brought us over to do a tour, and there was a tour of the Jamieson distillery. And I even though it's free and when I was meant to be writing about it, I just couldn't have a sort of because it just immediately made me feel sick because of my youthful experience. And I know a few people who have, I think a few people have got that drink, and it might be whiskey and it might be tequila, um, where they do something silly when they're young and they just can't there's an association with the smell that they just can't get over. But um I uh joined the British diplomatic service, and uh my first posting, I was Deputy Consul General in Düsseldorf, and the consul general was a Scottish guy and he loved whiskey, and I knew I'd have to drink whiskey as part of my job, partly for him, but also part of our job when we worked in government, we had a thing called whiskey diplomacy where we would r host whiskey tastings using Scots to endear ourselves to the locals wherever they were. And because I'm such a professional, I trained myself uh using one of my wife's friends uh who collected whiskey, he sort of got me started on like heavily watered down starter whiskies and got me to a point where I could appreciate whiskey. And then my first night in Düsseldorf, we hosted an event, all the guests went home, and I sat there with the Consul General and we drank half a bottle of Glenfiddick, and um I got through it no problem. And I've probably since that night, which would have been 2011, um, I've probably hosted a hundred whiskey tastings. Obviously, I've done over a hundred episodes of this podcast. I've got about 150 bottles in my collection um of whiskies from of all different price points. Um, and I've obviously tasted whiskies from you know the I tend not to drink the very cheap stuff anymore. But you know, I I'll I'll happily drink a you know, in a cocktail, I'll put bullet in a cocktail, but also I've been lucky enough a couple of times to drink 50-year-old Belveni that retails at $40,000 a bottle as well. Um so I don't own any of that, unfortunately, but I've I've had it. Um so yeah, so I I basically taught myself to drink whiskey so I could be better at my job as a British diplomat. Um and now I host a podcast about whiskey. So it's it's been a long journey, but a very exciting one for me. And um I do find, and the reason I did the podcast is because um you form relationships with people over a drink, and obviously you can have a beer with anybody, and I do, but there's something about whiskey and conversations around whiskey. And I remember introducing you to Chris at I think it was I think it was at one of our golf events, or maybe our gala dinner where he was doing a tasty, and like the look on your face when you got to meet the guy. Um I think we gave you a like an Alexander Murray jacket as well. Like, you know, this is your your present from your your bachelor party has become your whiskey, and now you're friends with the guy who owns the company, and you know, and that's just that's what whiskey is. Um, so that's why I do this podcast. Um, and that's how we started becoming better friends, so that's how it all works.

SPEAKER_03 39:46

Well, it's an amazing story. Um, and before going too uh too much off tangent with uh my adventures, I want to ask you a follow-up. What's the I guess one of the one of the bottles that you carish the most in your collection?

SPEAKER_00 40:01

I mean that's another good question. I think um I think I've got three, I would say. So my wife bought me a bottle of spring bank for our 10th wedding anniversary, which I've not opened yet. Um I actually got in trouble during the during the fires last January, or two January ago, I think it is now. We were evacuating, we had to evacuate the house because they oh we were fine, but we were told we should probably get out. So she's like, you know, everyone's like, run around the house and get what you need. So I ran around. I got I got the bottle, I got that bottle of whiskey and a couple of others actually put them in a box and we're about to leave. She's like, are we not gonna take any pictures of the kids? I'm like, oh yeah, yeah, okay. That bottle is uh got me in trouble. But um, and then uh actually Chris bought me a bottle. Um when I got my I'm now an American citizen, but when I got my green card, he bought me a bottle of Green Spot and it was engraved like welcome to America on it, uh, which I thought was very neat. Um and then I think it's probably um the third one is the Orange County Chocta Club whiskey. So uh for me that was a full circle moment. So uh we're the first sports team in America to have their own single mort whiskey. It's made with uh Alexander Murray, um, and Chris is one of my best friends, and uh like my sort of whiskey partner in crime, and it was great to actually do a proper project together. And obviously, my my uh if you were to ask people what the sort of three defining things about me would be, or like my three loves, they would probably say whiskey, football, and Vegas. Um of them are covered with that bottle. Um and so um, yeah, so I think they would be they would be my would be my three, my three wishes.

SPEAKER_03 41:53

No, those are amazing stories tied to each one. And uh I love to hear that. Uh because what better way to tell a story than with a good bottle of whiskey, right?

SPEAKER_00 42:00

Yeah. And actually, just I mean, I I'm not sure I should should do this, but sort of slightly shameless plug, but also shameless, desperate attempts. So one of the things about you which I find fascinating is obviously you know, you're very good at your various jobs, you've been a great partner to us, but you also seem to know everyone. Every time I go somewhere with you, you're like, oh yeah, I went to school with this like amazing person. And um uh I've not had anyone sort of gambling Vegas related on the podcast yet, but I'm trying to get on um the the head of gaming at the uh at the Yamafar casino who I was introduced by you to uh uh Anaheim Ducks Gala. Um and I think he gave us uh I think I was drinking a a Yamavar, I was a bourbon with Yamavar ice cubes in. Um like uh I'm gonna I'm gonna send him a link once I have to come on. Uh once I've got his dear friend Raphael on, then I can complete the uh the Vegas football uh uh triangle that I'm trying to complete.

SPEAKER_03 43:08

So I'm not mistaken, the Yamaha also owns a casino in Vegas.

SPEAKER_00 43:12

Yeah, they do, they own the palms, which is where I often stay when I go. So there's there's definitely a there's definitely um and you should try and get here, I know it's not his side of the business, but you've got to get him to get them to serve your four copers, because then um I can go to Vegas and drink your tequila, that would feel appropriate as well.

SPEAKER_03 43:31

We had a a mutual classmate of ours who also uh by way of his his brand um produced tequila, and for many years he was trying for me to take over that brand and introduce it with and to Peter. And so um I won't say the name of the brand or anything quite yet, but uh we there's still potential that I I end up partnering with them. Um but that's why I haven't approached Peter about four Copas because potentially it might be a mutual classmate of ours. That's why.

SPEAKER_00 44:00

Presumably Nevada's one of your states for four Copas.

SPEAKER_03 44:04

Correct. Yeah, uh Nevada's an important state for us. Um, but believe it or not, Georgia, the state of Georgia has quickly become an amazing uh state to be in. We we do very well in secondary markets, um, such as Minnesota, so the twin cities are been good uh uh to us as well.

SPEAKER_00 44:21

Very good. Um, right, it's my turn to ask you a question again. We're unfortunately at the end of the show, so I'm gonna ask you a question that I ask every guest, um, which is so we have to go back to whiskey for this. So um, if you could drink any whiskey with anyone, dead or alive, what would it be? Who would it be? And where would it be?

SPEAKER_03 44:48

Oh, that's a tough one. That's a very tough one. You know, I guess uh dead or alive. Oh I guess for me, the the first one that comes to mind uh would be my grandfather, uh, my mother's uh father, just because he is such a well-respected man. His legacy, uh, especially in Mexico, was so highly regarded as a man of great respect. And I would be drinking this Orange County Soccer Club uh whiskey, not as a plug or anything, but just to tell him look uh what your grandson has been able to do, look at the legacy that you've been able to leave and the development of both uh you his daughter and what her family and what they've been able to do. Um creating our own, I guess, path in life. Uh, I would be honored to have 10 minutes with him and drink some good whiskey because I know he he enjoyed his good tequilas, but I would also be honored as an as an American to teach him what a good whiskey and a good Scottish whiskey from our great uh friends uh would mean to us.

SPEAKER_00 45:56

Love that. Where would you drink it?

SPEAKER_03 45:59

I would drink it if possible. I would drink it on in the middle of the field, uh uh right there at Champions Stadium, just because I want uh it would really round out our story as from the highlands of Jalisco to right there at the Great Park. Uh the transition from where we were to where we are now, I think would be a really cool way because he loved America. Uh, he was such a big fan of the country and was thrilled to know that uh his daughter uh ended up, you know, having something to do with this country. Um so uh I th that would be really neat if I ever had a bit chance.

SPEAKER_00 46:38

Great answer. Very good. Look, Rafa and uh Taco and Tequila Impresario, thank you very much indeed for coming on the podcast.

SPEAKER_03 46:48

Thank you, my dear friend. Uh, you know, I always uh put you in such high regard uh for for yourself, and uh we always appreciate your support and your continuing uh journey with us along the taco and tequila adventures. So thank you for your time.

SPEAKER_00 47:02

Brilliant. Thank you.

SPEAKER_03 47:05

I love Scott, Scotch, Scotch, Scotch, and don't forget.